Kurt G. Harris MD

The PāNu approach to nutrition is grounded on clinical medicine and basic sciences disciplined by knowledge of evolutionary biology and paleoanthropology. The best evidence from multiple disciplines supports eating an animal-based diet high in fat, low in cereal grains and relatively low in carbohydrate.

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Saturday
Jan162010

Interview with Jimmy Moore

 

Here is a link to my hour-long interview with Jimmy Moore that was recorded in September 2009.

You can vote by clicking the appropriate level of star if so inclined.

I may be a poor one to judge it, but my wife Vicki thought I sounded reasonably good.

The interview was totally unscripted and Jimmy only deleted a ten-second awkward silence that occurred at the very beginning.

When Jimmy interviews you, you engage in a little preparatory banter to set things up. I can honeslty say I did not feel too nervous. I was sitting at my desk with a Sennheiser headset, a cup of coffee with cream, and the computer audio was jacked into my desktop B&W Zeppelin for sound quality. So, we are chatting along, and I'm thinking Jimmy is this nice southern gentleman and so easy to chat with for this opinionated midwesterner, and then he launches into his intro, which through my speakers, literally sounded like a carnival barker with a meagaphone had snuck into my living  room. I was so shocked I was literally speechless for about 10 seconds and could only guess at what he had just said - so I finally said "thank you".

From there on it went fine, once some part of my brain realized the carnival barker was only Jimmy, and he had by now shape-shifted back into a friendly southern Atkins practitioner.

I had forgot I called Zero Carb the "Hezbollah of the low carb movement". I like that.

Oh, and you will enjoy the sound they used to bleep my deployment of the word "bullshit" when describing what I thought when they told me eggs and bacon might be bad back in medical school. Vicki could not stop laughing.

Thanks to everyone who has donated! I've tried to send brief personal responses via email but might have missed a few. The donations and accompanying comments have been greatly appreciated!

 

Reader Comments (61)

Dr. Harris, you were sensational and the response I've received from my interview with you has been phenomenal. Something tells me that when I ask for the favorite podcast guests of 2010 later this year that we'll be having you back on for "Encore Week" in the first week of 2011. GREAT JOB and THANK YOU for all you are doing. Now, back to my carnival barking! LOL! :D

KGH: Jimmy, it was my pleasure. I maybe should have said "emcee" because I am sure you still have all ten fingers :)

January 16, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterJimmy Moore

I sacrificed my normal Saturday morning Metropolitan Opera broadcast to listen to your interview. I made a good choice (I don't like Carmen anyway). You have a good masculine voice and you were very natural and engaging. I am not a Jimmy Moore fan although I confess that I do read his menus simply to amaze myself. Regarding broken metabolisms, which I surely have after 60 years as a vegetarian, zero carb, however demonic some of its practitioners appear, is the only way that I can be whole and healthy. Since I limit my time at the computer to allow for full days of painting, your blog is now my sole source. I have forsaken all others for you and I hope that you appreciate that fact.

KGH: Wow, that's high praise and I hope I can live up to it. Let me be clear about what I mean by "zero carb". I am criticizing it as a doctrine, not as a macronutrient ratio. As someone who is not too tolerant of starch, I often eat nearly 0 carbs in any given day.

My definition of the Zero Carb Hezbollah is those who claim that paleolithic man had no consumption of plants and that for those with sound metabolism, that consuming any carbohydrate at all is unnatural and poisonous. I know that is heresy to those who quote the guy who made a fortune manufacturing LSD in the Haight like he is a prophet, but so be it :)

January 16, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterMarly Harris

Good stuff Dr. Harris,

I think you're the first person ever to disagree with Jimmy on his audio show.

January 16, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterDanny Roddy

Danny, nope, I've had many who disagree with me and that's okay. Although we may not all be on the exact same page with the various nuances of this way of eating, I think we all have the same goal -- to help people live healthy and manage their weight naturally with a high-fat, moderate-protein, low-carbohydrate nutritional approach. Just as long as we aren't disagreeable in the process, I think moving people closer to that lifestyle change is the ultimate end. THANKS for your comments!

January 16, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterJimmy Moore

Danny,

Lots of guests have been in disagreement on Jimmy's show. You should go back and listen to the podcast when Jimmy interviewed Dr. Dean Ornish... talk about disagreement! ;)

Kevan

January 16, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterKevan

Dr KGH

This may be the wrong place to call your attention to an article in the LA Times today about Dr Jeffry Life, but you will run into this subject sooner than later as time goes on. In terms of the science and the market for "anti-aging" ideas, it awaits your comments, I am sure; we will all be in this "market" of ideas as we hopefully embrace these years with gladness and gratitude of good health and not with trepidations of expense, both financially and a burden to our families, of sustaining decreasing quality of life. You're in the right ballpark at the right time and I find your articles very readable and very interesting; health care is on everyone's lips and many have an open ear for it today. So, then, what do you think of what this Dr Life is about?

TS

KGH: Have not seen it so cannot comment.

January 16, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterTS

http://www.latimes.com/features/health/la-he-jeffry-life18-2010jan18,0,187461.column

Summary: Steroids work on old people too.

They mentioned his "low-glycemic" diet and the fact that he was pre-diabetic, but beyond that they completely neglect diet or its implications.

January 16, 2010 | Unregistered Commenterpfw

Just listened, great content.

January 16, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterAnthony

DR.Kurt,i heard your podcast interview with Jimmy Moore and i have to say,you are the second best interview he has ever had. Sorry but Gary Taubes was my favorite and i dont think that would hurt your feelings,being second to MR.Taubes. After listening to you i went on your site and read all i could and printed out a ton of info,i know you dont have a weight problem but myself and probley a lot of your readers do,and you just helped me more than you can ever understand by listening to you and reading your site.I will be cutting way back on protein and uping my fat with cream and butter i had it backwards i ate wayyyyy to much protein.Let the fat lose begin.

thanks so much for your info.

January 16, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterBill

Haha, the silence at the beginning, followed by "Thank you." is awesome. Makes you sound very humble. Also you have a pretty cool voice for someone who smiles on his photos.

I listen to Jimmy's show regularly for motivation, and you were definitely one of the down-to-earth guests. I often get the feeling that the guests are too media-slick and nothing they say is even their opinion, just professional PR. Not so with you! Saying bullshit on international radio is priceless ;-)

January 16, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterBleicke

Glad to hear a physician with a physics perspective weighing in on physiology relative to nutrition. Excellent interview.

January 16, 2010 | Unregistered Commenterepistemocrat

Dr. Harris, I recently found your site and I am very glad that I did. I have read several of your posts and I really like it. I would like to know your thoughts on the acid/base balance in the body and if PaNu has a significant effect, positive or negative, in this regard. Thank you very much for your time.

Joe Thompson, TSgt, USAF

January 17, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterJoe Thompson

Really enjoyed the podcast, thank you!

January 17, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterHeyman

Wow, you have a really nice voice. :-)

I agree this was one of the top interviews on JM's podcast. Between the quality of your voice and your casual approach, I was hanging on every word. Another top interview, for me, was Dr. Seyfried's on ketosis and cancer prevention.

You do have the ultimate "cocktail napkin" diet. Especially liked your comment about the steps to help the most people and save the most lives.

Looking forward to a follow-up podcast. :)

January 17, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterMolly

Awesome Interview!

January 17, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterCMR

Great podcast. Really well explained

January 17, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterChris

i plan to listen to the interview at work in the morning!

i just started a blog and put your site on my blogroll if that is ookay..

http://malpaz.wordpress.com/

KGH: Sure!

January 17, 2010 | Unregistered Commentermallory

Do you include Coconut Oil and Palm Oil in your list of plant oils to avoid? I personally experienced a dramatic beneficial impact on my health and general wellbeing after adding Coconut Oil to my nutrition program

KGH: Coconut is excellent, palm is about 15% linoleic acid and I avoid it

January 17, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterPWVEGAS

Dr. Harris, I enjoyed the interview. I look forward to tweaking my diet to reflect some of the paleolithic nutrition views you have presented. Even though I have been following a lc diet, I too am realizing that I probably have been consuming way too much protein. Not sure how to up the fat, lower the protein; they usually go hand-in-hand. Eating cream, butter and avocado as foods and not as enhancements to other is going to seem odd.

I share your views on supplements. I took massive doses of supplements back in the Linus Pauling days only to find out later they were unnecessary and probably toxic. It seems that supplements fall in and out of favor like fads, and as with nutrition in general - it was never taken seriously enough where it was thought you might be doing some damage if you got it all wrong. I find it interesting though, that you make an exception for vitamin D. Shouldn't our bodies adapt as they did with the Intuits who got very little sun? Maybe you have covered this; I haven't read all your posts yet. I am curious if your views regarding supplements are based on the fact that you are a healthy guy and don't need them. What if you weren't healthy - what if you had blood tests that showed very high CRP readings for example, would you take COQ10, niacin or natural anti-inflammatory supplements, etc?

KGH: I am selective about supplements just like I don't randomly take drugs without a diagnosis.

If there is evidence of personal or widespread deficiency due to some element of modern life ( like D) then it is worth considering, otherwise the precautionary principle and the paleolithic principle (we did not evolve eating special supplements) should prevail.

January 17, 2010 | Unregistered Commenterkris

Loved your interview! I am now anticipating some of your future blogs that expand more what you recommend for those of us with "broken metabolisms" ---even though you explain that is not your primary audience. I have tried to read and understand previous blog posts and I want more!

January 17, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterAllison

I just listened to your interview with Jimmy Moore and 1) you do have an excellent voice, 2) the sound they used to cover 'bullshit' was a hoot and 3) it is always nice to hear the smart people talk for once. Great interview, great site - thank you.

Kate

January 17, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterKate

Kurt,

I am a lurking reader from your blog inception. I have been impressed with your rigorous approach. I am personally in a similar boat as yourself and am currently quite "metabolically" happy, but nevertheless, would like to see your approach propagated.

However, I have a question. I am curious as to whether you might put your theory into practice and join others of your generation, such as Dr Davis, as the baton passes from luminaries such as Dr Bernstein and the Drs Eades, the latter of whom appear to no longer practice. My guess (which is not backed by my money at this stage) is that you would be very successful. The business case for use of modern communications and testing technologies to extend the geographic reach of such a practice, appears to be strong. My guess is that if you had a strong "no compromise" (i.e no whacky science) brand untainted by other commercial interests, and used modern technology, you would be very successful and scalable.

As a fall back, you can always go back to looking at the end results of metabolic disorders via radiography and make a living!

p.s I find it very interesting and comforting, from a medical sociology point of view, that a number of the better authors wrt metabolic issues, who are broadly in your camp, are physicians who see the end results of such disorders, whether as radiographers, anesthetists, cardiologists, cardio surgeons, ER practitioners and ICU practitioners. All appear to be motivated to lose some business via addressing causes, not results.

KGH: Thanks for your thoughtful comments. As a radiologist, I am no stranger to teleradiology and am currently exploring doing some teleconsulting via skype (with or without video). There are some medicolegal and technical issues to work out and I need to decide if working at the individual level takes away from advancing things via the blog, book writing, etc.

If people could work with cooperative local MDs to do physical exams, have labs drawn, etc. with me as a consultant, that might be the best model. It might also be done as a tailored personal educational session with a written report the client (not patient, really) can bring to their MD.

January 17, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterHPTNS

Doc-
I can't agree with you more on the "Freak Flag", I live in Sturgeon Bay, WI and am really on my own team here on eating paleo...I've now wrap my brat in lettus and put spaghetti squash in my chili.

Chuck O

KGH: A local reader from the Frozen North - how exciting! Why not be really brave and try the chili all by it's lonesome?

January 18, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterChuck O

Kurt,

What did you mean during your interview when you said that the health effect of ice cream "depended on how it was made"? (I believe the context of the discussion was that you were listing high-sugar foods to avoid, candy, etc.)

I have experienced tremendous fitness benefits by taking my carbs from 55% to 30%, but I confess I do indulge in a small serving of full fat Haagez Daaz quite a bit. :)

Thanks,

Mark

KGH: I meant homemade with minimal sucrose, not "Haagen Daaz".

January 18, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterMark

Doc...
I'll run my chili naked next time...i just made some with buffalo..very tasty!

January 18, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterChuck O

Lovely interview and informative as usual. I particularly liked your anecdote about your and your wife's colleagues - how your offices are now populated by the slimmest medical professionals most of us have likely ever seen. Since the interview was recorded a while ago, I wonder if these same comments keep coming from patients and whether your colleagues all (as real-world experiments of n=10-12?) continue to maintain/lose weight, feel great, etc. Thanks!

KGH: Everyone has either progressed or maintained.

January 18, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterA

So, regarding the ice cream, is it better to use just pure sucrose for a sweetener instead of something like maple syrup or honey, or xylitol?
And, to Chuck O. you're not alone here in WI! I live in Appleton! :D
I need to make some chili....

KGH:

Maple syrup and honey are only sweet to the degree they have fructose - so it makes no difference.
Sugar alcohols I find disgusting, so I can't advise you on that.

January 18, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterIka

Dr. Harris,

Excellent interview with Jimmy! I had a chance to finally get to it during some down-time at work. I think I was impressed most of all in that you bowhunt! That truly is Paleo. Gotta love that white tail jerky. :) I don't know what large game you have in your area, but southern Alberta is a bow hunter's dream....white tail, mule deer, antelope, moose, and elk, my personal favorite.

I've posted a link to your interview on my blog( http://confessionsofacrossfitcoach.blogspot.com/ ), and also reproduced the "12 Steps", if you don't mind. It's an excellent resource for the "how-to" questions.

Thanks again for your informative website!

January 18, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterMike

I've enjoyed the interview. I have to listen to it again.
It's great that we can listen to your voice, it brings you closer to your readership.

January 19, 2010 | Unregistered Commentersimona

Hi,Doc.
I can only find half and half or heavy whipping cream,the heavy whipping cream says 0 sugar o carbs pure fat.The half and half has sugar and carbs,i picked the whipping cream to use is that ok? i cant find just cream any where.

KGH: Whipping cream is cream.

January 19, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterBill

Great interview. I particularly liked what you said about not being too strict about a paleo diet orientation, in connection with dairy for example.

I have just read a very insightful post on the Paleo Clinic blog.

http://paleoclinic.blogspot.com/2010/01/gluten-casein-running-and-thinking.html

We need a better understanding of the link between evolutionary pressures and paleo nutrition. Not everything is as simple as it looks, as show by that post.

The post discusses a brain response to glucose that may indeed be an adaptation that, while not very good for an individual human ancestor’s health in the long term, might have actually improved that ancestor’s reproductive success in the short term.

That is, this may be an evolved handicap, or costly trait.

Coincidentally, I have just posted on this topic, and its relationship to strict paleo dieting:

http://healthcorrelator.blogspot.com/

Take care, Ned

January 19, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterNed Kock

Dr. Harris,

I highly enjoy your site. Two pieces have me intellectually curious. One, what is your thoughts on an acid/alkaline balance, like including spinach in a meal to offset the steak, etc. Just purely from an acid/alkaline standpoint. Plus, with an eye towards Gout and similar related problems. Second, I thought I heard you say that vegetables have no value and was interested in your thoughts on the supposed eating style of most nutrients per calorie. Intellectually most nutrients per calorie makes sense to me, but I am wondering your take on that. I really appreciate your efforts here and the education you have provided. Trying to take what I am doing with myself and apply to my kids as well.

Have a good day,
Robert

KGH: I find it hard to believe HGs had to eat like they were managing the chemistry of a swimming pool. I am an acid/base balance skeptic for now.

I never said vegetables have no value, just not as valuable as animal products and not magic.

January 19, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterRobert

In "Getting Started," you mentioned that you were about 156-157 lbs in June. May I ask you how tall are you and your present weight?

Thanks,

Rob

KGH: 5' 11" 153 lbs

January 19, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterRob

Some fruits still just seem to work, like seemingly fructose-laden pomegranate, as a juice ?

"The patients' serum paraoxonase 1 (PON 1) activity was increased by 83%, whereas serum LDL basal oxidative state and LDL susceptibility to copper ion-induced oxidation were both significantly reduced, by 90% and 59%, respectively, after 12 months of PJ consumption, compared to values obtained before PJ consumption. Furthermore, serum levels of antibodies against oxidized LDL were decreased by 19%, and in parallel serum total antioxidant status (TAS) was increased by 130% after 1 year of PJ consumption. Systolic blood pressure was reduced after 1 year of PJ consumption by 12% [corrected] and was not further reduced along 3 years of PJ consumption."

http://www.pompills.com/pdf/clinical_nutrition.pdf

Sounds almost magic to me.

KGH: I guess now we poison our livers with pomegranate juice while we wait for $10 million and 10 years to fund the randomized trial to see if it actually works.

January 19, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterJohnny Bourdeaux, PhD

Hey Doc,
i had a fasting blood sugar test done at the doctors yesterday it was 148,a little high but i do weigh 320. And take seraquil xr and a water pill out of all the meds i take those can raise blood sugar.I just started uping my fat yesterday so i will have it checked again in a month.

KGH: 148 fasting is pretty high, technically diabetic. Read Dr. Bernstein's diabetes solution.

January 20, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterBill

I actually quite like butter sticks and could eat them as-is. Melted butter, spoonfuls of butter, butter in my tea; love it!

--"people aren't likely to start eating butter sticks"

January 20, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterWinalot

http://jama.ama-assn.org/cgi/reprint/187/2/100

This is an old starvation for weight loss study from the 60s.
---------------------------------------------------
In two cases of acute
gouty arthritis in this group, specific treatment or
ingestion of protein in adequate amounts resulted
in prompt alleviation of clinical symptoms.
.........................................

The
hyperuricemia seems to be a result of catabolism
of cells, coupled with a decrease in renal excre¬
tion of uric acid. These experiences would suggest
that obese patients who are known to have gout
should avoid total starvation and also reducing diets
leading to a negative protein balance.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

They used to treat gout with glycine, which increased urinary output of uric acid, but there was some debate as to whether glycine competed with uric acid for reuptake in the kidney, or just provided substrate for making more uric acid to be excreted. Excessive catabolism of purines might be expected to create a greater requirement for dietary protein rather than decreased. A lot of the bad effects of fructose in rodents are lessened when their diet is supplemented with glycine. Maybe some of the pain of gouty arthritis isn't even caused by the accumulation of the uric acid, but because of a local deficiency of glycine? If any of this makes any sense, I guess even non-gouty degeneration of cartilage might have fructose intake as a factor.
I hope this isn't too off-topic. I enjoyed the interview, if that helps;)

KGH: Google : Missing chapter on gout from GCBC :

It is the fructose consumption that causes it in the first place.

If you are hyperuricemic, excess purine metabolism could make it flare. If you go VLC without enough carbs so that you are required to do some gluconeogenesis to get your glucose, your gout can flare - I've had that reported a few times.

January 20, 2010 | Unregistered Commenterdonny

Anyone who has been following low carb bloggers, podcast etc. is starting to grasp the main concepts, and most of these concepts such as fat is not evil, ketones are the bodies preferred fuel and grains are basically useless are echoed by most low carb/paleo advocates. Once of the biggest controversial topics, even among low carb doctors/spokespeople is that of meal timing - my paleo instincts are telling me that this may be one of the most important topics that need more discussion.

Just when I think the appropriate decision is to not have a snack….I read some contrary advice. I have recently read a nutritionist explain that individuals with a ‘broken metabolism’ will over shoot insulin in response to the liver’s release of glycogen, and that this happens aprox. 5 hrs after a meal. Ugh! Help!

KGH: I can't comment on every tidbit, but if you were to stick to my blog and those on my blog roll you will encounter fewer confusing statements from "nutritionists" like that one.

January 20, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterMarie

It is a good idea for people to look at their background, because they may have inherited genes that predispose them to function better with certain types of diets.

A nutrition-related genetic mutation can spread to an entire population in as little as 396 years, or even less depending on the circumstances. I posted about this here:

http://healthcorrelator.blogspot.com/2010/01/how-long-does-it-take-for-food-related.html

KGH:

Well, as a general statement about how fast a single mutation can propagate I don't disagree, but the important genes that relate to metabolism are actually many hundreds of genes that all work together- how macronutrients are processed, micronutrient requirements, neurohormonal regulation, ability to handle stuff outside our evolutionary experience, these things as a practical matter are pretty deep in the genome and pretty conservative, even over millions of years.

So the background to look at is if you are human, not if, for example you have 300 generations of grain consumption or 4 of vegetable oils.

Yes, there are genetic differences in lactase and probably starch tolerance, but metabolic typing is a bogus concept.

January 21, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterNed Kock

Dear Dr, Harris,

"If you are hyperuricemic, excess purine metabolism could make it flare. If you go VLC without enough carbs so that you are required to do some gluconeogenesis to get your glucose, your gout can flare - I've had that reported a few times."

Taubes gives a great overview on causes, but do you have any suggestions on lowering uric acid levels? I'm Type 2, I eat to my meter, which means VLC (high fat), but my uric acid levels went from high normal to high the last time they were checked.

Eating a low purine diet seems out of the question (breads, pasta, skim milk, oh my!) , and the jury seems to be out on the efficacy of it anyway.

One thing that stuck out for me in the Jimmy Moore talk was your discussion of Jimmy's carb intake limits, the idea of a broken metabolism, and whether it could be restored. There seems to be a big difference in results from people like you (admitting weight has never been an issue) and people like me (my H1Ac was 5.5%, but still have stubborn dawn phenomenon and have sat at 202-205 lbs for months). Is it just a time thing?

Anyway, thanks for the great blog, it truly gives people like me some hope!

Dave Mc

KGH:

Besides taking allopurinol, keeping overall protein low and fructose zero, and keeping glucose consumption high enough to avoid having GNG kick in is all I can think of for now. I am sure there are some other supplement type strategies - try googling and using pubmed. I have not researched it extensively.

January 21, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterDave Mc

I just came off my first 24 hour fast yesterday at 4pm. I ate tilapia with a butter, mayo, parmesan cheese crust along with steamed broccolli. I took some fish oil, probiotics, phyllum husks, and a Cal/Mag/Vit.D supplement. After about two hours, I experienced diarrhrea and today as well.
Is it normal to experience it after a fast? Can you recommend eating something else after breaking a fast? I am doing another fast today and then I will wait until next week to try another one.

KGH: Fish oil, phyllum husks (???) magnesium supplements - too many non-food variables there.

January 21, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterRob

Thanks Dr. Harris,

Dr. T at Nephropal is not too keen on allupurinol, and one of the side effects seems to be an increase in the incidence of gout attacks!

I do try to keep protein low (I shoot for about .8 - 1g per kg ideal body weight, ala Kwasniewski), and cut out fructose as much as possible.

I did some searching on pubmed, and decided to try some celery extract, and some quercetin/bromelain. After your posts on plants, however, I'm not too optimistic. Will see at the end of February, my next scheduled tests.

Re GNC, my liver seems to kick out glucose in the AM no matter what I do. My waking BG is usually around 120, then it shoots up over the next few hours (even when fasting), sometimes close to 140. Peter's posts at Hyperlipid (don'tcha just love that guy!) on hepatic insulin resistance are very good, and he gets a little bit of dawn phenomenon, but not to the same extent and his HA1c is good.

Anyway, thank you again for the blog.

Dave Mc

KGH:

My bias against plants being magic for the average person does not mean they have no medicinal use. If you have have gout, look into it.

January 21, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterDave Mc

Hi Kurt.

There is no doubt that Mendelian traits are rare, although they do exist. What I refer to in the post are traits influenced (not determined) by genotypes. A genotype may be comprised of many genes, at different loci and even chromosomes.

If you talk to animal breeders, they will tell you that they can select for almost anything, and obtain a response (sometimes strong, other times weak) in a few generations. This applies to metabolic responses of the animals on which selection pressure is being applied - in this case artificial selection, by the breeders.

The reason is that there is a great deal of genetic diversity in almost any population of unrelated individuals. If selection pressure is applied (e.g., a few humans get stranded in an island) a genotype (not a gene) may evolve into fixation in as little as 400 years (assuming about 20 years for each generation).

KGH:

"If you talk to animal breeders, they will tell you that they can select for almost anything, and obtain a response (sometimes strong, other times weak) in a few generations.'

Almost anything? Any animal breeder that told me that I would regard as a first class BS'er.

Can cows be selected to eat meat? Can tigers be bred to eat soybeans?

These are the types of changes that would have meaning. Selecting for body size or coat color are trivial.

I took the time to read your post and it says nothing really specific regarding diet at all and you have not given an example of how we should "pay attention to out background" so I am left to guess what you mean.

There is genetic variability and natural and artificial selection both work. We know that. Important aspects of animal metabolism like the role of hormones depend on hundreds of genes - artificial selection to, say, breed an animal that needs no insulin like the naked mole rat would take so long as to be virtually unthinkable.

January 21, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterNed Kock

Phylum Husks are not need on the PaNu lifestyle?

Rob

January 21, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterRob

"Phylum Husks are not need on the PaNu lifestyle?"

Correct (unless you enjoy elephantine BMs).

January 22, 2010 | Unregistered Commentercaphuff

Hi Dr. Harris,
I'm 40, female, always been overweight all my life (currently 180, hoping for 140 - 5' 4"), hypothyroid... So, I started Atkins induction at the beginning of january, which is very similar to your 12 steps - the only little bit of carbs I've had were from veggies... Pounds are slow to drop but I haven't exercised much... I plan on continuing this for a while... I know you have this written all over your site, but I guess I'm just needing personal re-assurance - but if I just keep going, the pounds will come off as a result of my broken metabolism healing itself, correct?... With the hypothyroid, it seems that it makes losing pounds that much harder... Being on this plan, my appetite has decreased tremendously so I'm satisfied with a very small amount of food, especially if it's high fate (chuck roast, egg salad, dark meat chicken and turkey...) I appreciate any insight you may have that can help me out - it's quite frustrating sometimes - although this is a much easier lifestyle for me to folllow than low-fat/whole grain stuff - I just might be able to keep it up in the long run!
Much thanks for all your hard work!

KGH: I assume you are getting your TSH in the sub 1.5 range with thyroxine or dessicated thyroid?

Other than that, not much to add.

January 22, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterPMP

Yes, I have a great endo who believes in traditional meds as well as other techniques - currently taking synthroid with T3 compound - TSH finally went down to 1.2 - she wants me closer to 0.5... Armour gave me the jitters -for what it'sworth...

Great - I'll just keep it up! I'll try to add a daily walk - hopefully that'll help getting rid of the fat... Thanks...

KGH:

Yes, armour has a lot of T3 relative to T4, so adding cytomel to T4 can be better for some - sounds like you have great doc. Read "how to lose weight" and pay attention to meal frequency. Good luck.

January 23, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterPMP

Hi Kurt,
recently i saw some research about the effect of eating fat on insulin. There was mentioned palmitic acid, which is in dairy products, like butter and also in meat. If that's true how come one can't one become insulin and leptin resistant with your eating lots of butter, cream and meat? What do you think?

read: http://healthblogs.org/2009/09/18/ice-cream-may-target-the-brain-before-your-hips/

some quotes:
"the fat molecules cause the brain to send messages to the body’s cells, warning them to ignore the appetite-suppressing signals from leptin and insulin, hormones involved in weight regulation."....
"The researchers also found that one particular type of fat — palmitic acid — is particularly effective at instigating this mechanism."
“What we’ve shown in this study is that someone’s entire brain chemistry can change in a very short period of time. Our findings suggest that when you eat something high in fat, your brain gets ‘hit’ with the fatty acids, and you become resistant to insulin and leptin,” Dr. Clegg said. “Since you’re not being told by the brain to stop eating, you overeat.”
Palmitic acid is a common saturated fatty acid occurring in foods such as butter, cheese, milk and beef. Oleic acid, on the other hand, is one of the most common unsaturated fatty acids. Olive and grapeseed oils are rich in oleic acid.

“We found that the palmitic acid specifically reduced the ability of leptin and insulin to activate their intracellular signaling cascades,” Dr. Clegg said. “The oleic fat did not do this. The action was very specific to palmitic acid, which is very high in foods that are rich in saturated-fat.”
"
I placed this question here, because I know you moderate comments and I haven't got your emailaddress.

Greetings,
George

KGH:

The researchers are no doubt confused by their own anti fat bias, but I can't say how unless you give me the full text study.

Please only send me these things for comment if you have a real article - this a media press release!

Palmitic acid induces peripheral insulin resistance temporarily, which is a normal physiologic phenomenon.

This supposed temporary effect on the brain from eating sat fat explains perfectly how my wife and I lost nearly 40 lbs between us getting 30% or so of our calories from saturated fat :)

The pathologic insulin resistance we are trying to avoid is in the liver.

All VLC diets induce peripheral insulin resistance as an adaptation to maintain blood glucose levels. This is mediated both via fat like palmitic acid and by carbohydrate consumption.

I suppose they have identified some brain signaling that appears "paradoxical" to them in the same way peripheral insulin resistance with low carb eating appears paradoxical if you don't think about it carefully. But again, this is just a press release, so who knows?

By the way, email is on the "about me" page. Also these "challenge" posts, if not emailed to me, are best posted in Q/A.

January 23, 2010 | Unregistered CommenterGeorge

check out peter at hyperlipid for an explanation of the role of palmitic acid induced insulin resistance [bottom line- not a bug but a feature]:

http://high-fat-nutrition.blogspot.com/search/label/Physiological%20insulin%20resistance%20%287%29%20and%20palmitic%20acid%20again

KGH: Yes, I've referred to those posts (physiologic insulin resistance) many times ad Stephan has posted on it as well. Thanks, Jeff.

January 23, 2010 | Unregistered Commenterjeff klugman

here's the article on centrally mediated insulin resistance

http://www.jci.org/articles/view/36714

in the discussion it mentions fatty acid induced insulin resistance as a mechanism for weight maintenance in the obese. maybe. the role for palmitic acid induced insulin resistance outlined by peter seems reasonable in a healthy metabolism. what remains to be discussed, however, is how things function once someone's metabolism is "broken."

KGH:

Thanks, Jeff. Rodents, I see :) That might explain a lot - quite a different econiche between the furry guys and humans. I'll read it tonight.

The most important distinction is between pathologic liver insulin resistance and physiologic muscle insulin resistance which was originally a well known phenomenon but now seems to be forgotten - they are usually conflated conceptually and they are always conflated when you equate insulin resistance with glucose handling in toto ( OGTT for example)

January 23, 2010 | Unregistered Commenterjeff klugman
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